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INTERVIEW: Historian Dr. David Contosta on Lincoln…and Darwin?!

In anticipation of our February Exhibition commemorating the bi-centennial of Abraham Lincoln’s Birthday, I have been doing a fair deal of research on The Man, The Martyr, The Legend, and his legacy in both printed matter and theory. In my travels through the topsy-turvy world of US History, I came upon a recently published (April 2008) volume entitled Rebel Giants: The Revolutionary Lives of Abraham Lincoln & Charles Darwin, written by local professor and historian David Contosta.

What on earth do Abe Lincoln and Charles Darwin have to do with one another?! I wondered. A closer read into the piece piqued my interest, and I contacted Dr. Contosta. It turns out that he will be embarking on a speaking tour during the month of February, which includes a lecture at The Union League in Philadelphia on February 26! Luckily for me, though, I had the opportunity to chat with the history expert himself, and learned much about the lives of two extraordinary figures and the man who is bringing it all to light…

Robin: Good morning! Please tell me a little bit about yourself and what you do.

David Contosta: I’m a professor of history at Chestnut Hill College in Philadelphia. I’m the author of sixteen books on a variety of topics. I have written about Philadelphia and the United States in the 20th century. Most recently I’ve published Rebel Giants, which is about Abraham Lincoln and Charles Darwin, who were both born on February 12, 1809.

RM: Are you a native Philadelphian?

DC: No I am not. I grew up in Lancaster, Ohio, which is a bit southeast of Columbus. But I’ve been out here for a long time.

RM: How did you become involved in researching both Lincoln AND Darwin?

DC: About six years ago, I was reading a new biography of Charles Darwin, and on the first page the author said he had been born on February 12, 1809. I thought, “That date sounds familiar. Isn’t it Lincoln’s birthday?” So I checked it out and found that they were born on the same day in the same year. They were the two giants of the 19th century English-speaking world, and continue to be two of the most important people who ever lived, for that matter. They shook their world and our world. I started to read about both, and saw the possibility of a book.

RM: What do you think caused this coincident “greatness”?

DC: My daughter says jokingly, “It was all in the stars.” But really, if either one had been born ten years earlier or later, it would not have been the right place and the right time. Someone else would have come up with a probable theory of evolution. And since the whole slavery question was coming to a head in the US, if Lincoln hadn’t done what he did, someone else would have, though perhaps not in the same way. One of the questions historians ask is “Was it the person or the time?” The answer is obviously both.

RM: What are some of the most interesting parallels you have discovered between the two men?

DC: 1. They both belonged to an Anglo-American community. Great Britain remained America’s greatest trading partner in 1809 and for a long time thereafter. But it was also the trade of ideas. The anti-slavery movement in both countries, similar literature…I could go on and on…

2. Both Lincoln and Darwin lost their mothers when they were children. They were brought up by mother surrogates who perhaps were better than their real mothers. Lincoln’s father remarried, and his stepmother encouraged him in a way that Lincoln’s mother would not have. She stood between Abraham and his father, since he was angry that Abraham was reading and not doing farmwork. Darwin had three older sisters. Darwin’s mother was sickly and couldn’t tend the children, so he ended up with with three mothers instead of one.

3. Both men were estranged from their fathers and rebelled against their respective expectations. Lincoln despised his father and was ashamed of him because he was illiterate and could barely sign his name. Lincoln was determined not to be like him. When his father lay dying, requesting his presence, Lincoln refused to see him, and did not attend the funeral.

Darwin’s father was not particularly brutal, but was depressed and disappointed in his son. He was a medical doctor and wanted his son to become a doctor or a priest for the Church of England.

Thomas Lincoln and Sarah Bush Johnston Lincoln (stepmother)

4.  They rebelled against the accepted truths of their time. Darwin rejected the idea that God created every living thing 6000 years ago. Lincoln rejected the idea that black people were inferior. He took literally the opening words of the Declaration of Independence.

5.  Both were self-taught. Although Darwin had a Cambridge University degree, he didn’t major in the sciences. Lincoln had less than one year of formal education.

6.  Neither one had eureka moments or flashes of insight, but were tenacious in their searches for answers. Both were skilled politicians. We know that Lincoln was, but Darwin was, too, in lining up people to speak in his favor.

7.  They both wanted to be famous. Many people think Lincoln was just sitting at home waiting for people to come beg him to be President. This was not the case, as they both were extraordinarily ambitious.

8.  Both suffered from depression and melancholia. Lincoln seemed suicidal on a few different occasions. Darwin also suffered from depression, particularly when he became aware of what reactions his ideas were going to provoke in others.

9.  Both went through terrible religious struggle. Darwin ended up as an agnostic. Lincoln was never baptized. Most people don’t know this fact. He never went to church or took communion. Lincoln did not believe in the divinity of Christ, although he was fully familiar with the Bible, because he had to read it. So according to Christian doctrine, when Lincoln was assassinated in 1855, he did not go to Heaven. There’s a lithograph made in Philadelphia from that time, however, showing Lincoln dying and going into Heaven toward Washington.

Despite their unorthodox beliefs, both were embraced by religious authorities. The Sunday after Lincoln’s assassination was known as Black Sunday. Priests went wild comparing Lincoln to Christ, making men free. Darwin is buried in Westminster Abbey. The Dean of Westminster realized that Darwin was important.

Darwin’s Grave at Westminster Abbey

10.  Both of them asserted the essential humanity of all people, despite social barriers. They both succeeded, as rebels, and their ideas continue to shape our world.

RM: You gave a lecture on Rebel Giants in Nanjing, China. What was that like? Are Lincoln and Darwin universal icons?

DC: The students really seemed to know something about both of them. They were interested in the rebel aspect and very aware of American politics. I gave the talk right before our election, and they knew all about it. 

One student asked, “Do you think there’s still too much racial prejudice in your country to elect a black person as president?” I said, “There would have been 35 or 40 years ago, but I don’t think so now.”

Another young man commented, “Well, your stock market is going down and your economy’s in trouble. The democrats will probably do better, and it won’t matter.” I was blown away.

A young woman came up afterward and said, “During the primary I was for Hillary because I think it would be nice to have a woman elected President.” She lowered her voice and said, “You know women are supposed to be equal to men in China, but we’re really not. The men still control the government.”

Another student asked, “Why do you have an amendment in your Constitution that allows people to buy guns and go around shooting each other?” I tried to explain the Second Amendment, and he said, “I know I know, it goes back to the time when you had militias in the Colonial Period.” I told them that this was really a problem in Philadelphia. That about 500 people a year are killed by handguns. They couldn’t understand why our government would allow that.

All in all, it was a tremendous experience. The professors asked me if I’d consider coming back in Fall 2009 as a visiting professor. I hope I can do it.

RM: What interests YOU most about Lincoln: his life, death, or image?

DC: I am interested in all of those things. The last two chapters of my book talk about the iconography of Lincoln and Darwin. I was particularly interested in sculpture of Lincoln. His son, Robert, was very upset that a statue, made in the 1910s, was done to make him look very realistic. He wanted it to look more like the “Father Abraham” figure in the Lincoln Memorial, the biblical patriarch.

RM: Neither Lincoln nor Darwin was terribly popular during his lifetime. It does seem, though, that the further away we get from their deaths, the portraiture becomes more romantic, more handsome…

DC: Yes, to some extent, it has. At the time, a lot of people made fun of Darwin, putting his head on a monkey’s body in cartoons.

A Darwin cartoon from the 1800s

Political cartoon showing Lady Liberty disappointed in Lincoln

Lincoln, though, really died at exactly the right time in exactly the right way. He died a martyr’s death on Good Friday. He was despised in the South, but there were a lot of people in the North who didn’t like him and thought the Civil War was unecessary. I think that if Lincoln had served out his second term, he would have gotten into fights with Congress over Reconstruction. He is seen as a successful President, and by dying at such a dramatic moment, his reputation is sealed in fame.

Darwin, on the other hand, outlived Lincoln by seventeen years, and was able to enjoy his fame to some degree. It’s funny that Darwin is more of a controversial figure now than Lincoln is.

RM: How do you think Lincoln and Darwin would feel about today’s current events: from Intelligent Design to Obama’s election?

DC: Darwin did not believe in intelligent design at all, and would not have accepted that compromise. So he would have been very upset by what went on in Dover, PA. I also think that what Lincoln and Darwin did have joined together and come full circle. Lincoln did have some racist views, yet he was able to overcome that. He did think slavery was wrong and that people were equal. Darwin did, too. He was horrified by slavery. His work leads to the discovery of DNA, which shows that racial differences are cultural. The biological revolution that Darwin began and the civil rights revolution that Lincoln began come full circle and reinforce each other. They are both about excising inequality.

Barack Obama, in many ways, represents and personifies that. Obama also came from a broken family background. His father was not present.  He went through many trials and struggles as a young person to become extraordinarily successful. I find that parallel to be a very interesting one. And of course, the Illinois connection. With Lincoln living in Springfield and Obama launching his campaign in front of the old State House, across the street from Lincoln’s law office.

 

RM: What would you ask Lincoln and Darwin if they were still alive?

DC: I would ask Lincoln where he thinks his experiment has gone and if he’s satisfied. I would ask Darwin to reminisce about where his theory has gone where he thinks it’s going to go. I would ask Darwin what he thinks of Lincoln and Lincoln what he thinks of Darwin.

RM: And the two men never met?

DC: No, although Lincoln was fascinated with the concept of evolution. He had read some earlier works. His law partner had some of Darwin’s works in the office. I don’t know if Lincoln ever read The Origin of Species. Darwin read news about the American Civil War with a mix of curiosity and horror.

RM: Any closing comments?

DC: It is important to note that Lincoln was assassinated by technology. Both men, however, were living at a time of larger change: The Industrial Revolution. When modernization was taking hold. When the emphasis switched from society or the individual to progress. Darwin’s theory of natural selection based on competition was part of this upheaval in Western civilization and so was the opposition to slavery. 

RM: And last but not least, how do you take your eggs?

DC: Different ways. Sometimes an omelette, sometimes scrambled eggs, sometimes sunny side up eggs!

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A warm thank you to Dr. David Contosta for sharing his research and expertise! I am now looking forward to the upcoming bi-centennial celebration even more!